Selecting Against MCF

Admin Posts : 362 Join date : 2012-07-05

In real life breeding operations, breeders will select for and against certain physical characteristics, and especially against certain major conformation faults.

So I got the idea...

As this is a breeding group focused on strict selection of breeding and performance prospects, shouldn't we put more of heavy penalty on horses with certain MCF? Or even those with it in their pedigree or offspring. There are certain faults I believe would be very undesirable in RL DHHs, such as

ewe-neck
sway-back
upright pasterns
bench knees
low tail set
post-legged
fine-boned

There is no list of all the possible faults, so there may be more, but I believe these would hurt a harness horse's career the most.

I want everyone's opinion. Should we place heavier penalties on horses either with these faults, these faults in their breeding pedigree, or if they have produced a foal with these faults.

Poll closes in 5 days.

Posts : 264 Join date : 2012-07-23

I think once the breed gets more established we can get more selective, I have some nice foals out of Tin Tin but he has mutton withers, the big question is will my foals pass that on?? In my opinion right now we keep it like it is and don't accept the horses that have any faults.

Admin Posts : 362 Join date : 2012-07-05

ShannonHM wrote:: I think once the breed gets more established we can get more selective, I have some nice foals out of Tin Tin but he has mutton withers, the big question is will my foals pass that on?? In my opinion right now we keep it like it is and don't accept the horses that have any faults.

Horses with any major fault will be selected against no matter what. I am proposing that horses with these specific faults in their pedigree receive a slight dock or something.

Posts : 81 Join date : 2012-07-06

Is that because they have a higher probability of passing it on, since it is in their pedigree? I love TinTin, but he does seem to like to pass on that fault. Evil or Very Mad

Admin Posts : 362 Join date : 2012-07-05

Hayden Valley 1 wrote:: Is that because they have a higher probability of passing it on, since it is in their pedigree? I love TinTin, but he does seem to like to pass on that fault.

Yes, But I don't think we need to put pressure on all MCF, maybe just the ones listed above. I think they would have the worst effects on a fine harness horse.

Posts : 15 Join date : 2012-07-07

If we're going to reconsider how to penalize MCFs, would it be possible to "exclude" some of them? Stuff like toed-in and toed-out...I've met a good number of RL horses (almost all) that would have this fault...it's almost a bit nit-picky.

Admin Posts : 362 Join date : 2012-07-05

Shyy wrote:: If we're going to reconsider how to penalize MCFs, would it be possible to "exclude" some of them? Stuff like toed-in and toed-out...I've met a good number of RL horses (almost all) that would have this fault...it's almost a bit nit-picky.

It could go that way yes, though the purpose of this registry is to select for only the best individuals. I agree that some things like "toed-out" may not be that bad, but are they really the best stock to select for breeding?

Posts : 264 Join date : 2012-07-23

Are the faults above the one's we are voting on?

Admin Posts : 362 Join date : 2012-07-05

ShannonHM wrote:: Are the faults above the one's we are voting on?

Not necessarily. If we do decide to implement this, there will be further discussion on the exact faults we should avoid most.

Does everyone get where I am coming from on this?

Say you are a RL breeder, and you want to breed top quality show horses. While you were out shopping for breeding stock, wouldn't you shy away from certain faults? I feel like here on E-R we do acknowledge them and want to breed away from them, but sometimes we overlook them, and pick up bloodstock that have many faults.

In E-R it is easy for us to breed them out. The foal either has one fault or it doesn't. In RL if you were to breed say a sway backed mare to a bench kneed stallion, there is the possibility the foal will inherit both faults, something we don't see here on E-R. So it's easier for us.

But then again in RL, if you bred the sway back mare with a good stallion there is always a possibility the foal won't sway. But how often does a foal look like just one of its parents in all ways? Pretty stinkin rarely. Most likely that foal will still have a weaker back, somewhat like both parents', and has the potential to produce sway back offspring. We get off easy on E-R and don't see this or deal with it much at all.

So basically, my idea is to just add more challenge and realisticness to our breeding. I know I am guilty of having several horses with MCF Embarassed

Posts : 264 Join date : 2012-07-23

I completely understand where you are coming from, in RL I wouldn't breed a mare to a stallion with a fault or vice versa, I guess I'm just concerned because what does this do for the foals we have already bred and are on the ground?

I'm all for putting rules into effect for future breeding but in my opinion foals already bred should be excluded unless they come up with faults.

Admin Posts : 362 Join date : 2012-07-05

ShannonHM wrote:: I completely understand where you are coming from, in RL I wouldn't breed a mare to a stallion with a fault or vice versa, I guess I'm just concerned because what does this do for the foals we have already bred and are on the ground?

I'm all for putting rules into effect for future breeding but in my opinion foals already bred should be excluded unless they come up with faults.

Any horses with faults will not be accepted no matter what. That is already in place. I am just proposing that horses with certain faults in their breeding pedigree receive a small point dock on their 6 or 10+YO keurings. You could still use a faulted horse for breeding if you wish.

But, I'll bring this up at a later date perhaps. After we have gotten a bit further in our accomplishments Smile